Communications & Generators
Question:
I’m moving off grid in June and looking for ideas so as to continue with email thru an ISP. Will be in an area where the wireless palm pilot systems doesn’t cover. Am considering using a cell phone interfaced to a desk-type computer (120 VAC), and using a gas generator to run it. I’ve heard there are problems using inverters to power computers…. plus I’ll need to run the generator a half hour every two days anyway. (plus….a lap-top is too expensive for me). A few questions: Is the voltage output from a 5 KW Generak type generator fairly ‘clean’…..no harmful spikes to sensitive equipment ?? Is a filtering network advised ?? Can anyone recommend a brand and model of a (digital & analog) cell phone that will connect to an external antenna, interface to computer and be charged by a 12 VDC power source ?? Any other ideas or options ?? Thanks, Bill in Oregon
Response:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->I’m moving off grid in June and looking for ideas so as to continue >with email thru an ISP. > Will be in an area where the wireless palm pilot systems doesn’t >cover. >Am considering using a cell phone interfaced to a desk-type computer >(120 VAC), and using a gas generator to run it. I’ve heard there are >problems using inverters to power computers…. plus I’ll need to run >the generator a half hour every two days anyway. (plus….a lap-top >is too expensive for me). > A few questions: >Is the voltage output from a 5 KW Generak type generator fairly >’clean’…..no harmful spikes to sensitive equipment ?? Is a >filtering network advised ??
The Generac output is clean. A generator can’t absorb load-induced surges (compressors starting, etc) as well as the utilities can. >Can anyone recommend a brand and model of a (digital & analog) cell >phone that will connect to an external antenna, interface to computer >and be charged by a 12 VDC power source ?? >Any other ideas or options ?? >Thanks, Bill in Oregon
External antennas are great. I’ll leave it to the more knowledgeable to recommend any specific cell/modem units. btw, computers work just fine on "modified sine wave" inverters. zero
Response:
Modems over cell phones are still very slow in the US. You might get 9600 baud under ideal conditions. That would limit you pretty much to text-only type traffic. You would want to buy a cell phone service plan that has lots of free minutes. Otherwise online-airtime will get costly real quick. Another alternative to consider is satellite. StarBand (associated with DirectTV) sells a service in the US for about $70/month. RadioShack is a reseller of their services and will probably have some additional information. For discussion see the alt.satellite.internet newsgroup. Originally, you had to buy a specially outfitted PC to get StarBand service, but I believe that they now sell add-on satellite modems that can be used with almost any PC (~$400). There have been a number of complaints by people on the lack of service by StarBand, and also much ranting over less than expected (broadband) performance. Even with these limitations, it will be a whole lot faster than currently available cell phone modems. Emerging cell technologies (BlueTooth?) may change this landscape quickly depending on your local area. Metropolitan areas seem to be the first to benefit by availability of new technologies and services. Rural areas are the last to get the new wiz-bang technologies. A PC should work fine off of a small cheap inverter. PC’s ride out crappy power better than most other appliances. You might consider buying a couple of 6v 220ah Golf Cart type batteries at Sam’s club (~$40) and recharge them with an automotive type charger when you run your generator. A 400 watt inverter can be found for about $30 and will do the job fine. That way, you can use the computer in relative tranquility with the generator silent.
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> I’m moving off grid in June and looking for ideas so as to continue > with email thru an ISP. > Will be in an area where the wireless palm pilot systems doesn’t > cover. > Am considering using a cell phone interfaced to a desk-type computer > (120 VAC), and using a gas generator to run it. I’ve heard there are > problems using inverters to power computers…. plus I’ll need to run > the generator a half hour every two days anyway. (plus….a lap-top > is too expensive for me). > A few questions: > Is the voltage output from a 5 KW Generak type generator fairly > ‘clean’…..no harmful spikes to sensitive equipment ?? Is a > filtering network advised ?? > Can anyone recommend a brand and model of a (digital & analog) cell > phone that will connect to an external antenna, interface to computer > and be charged by a 12 VDC power source ?? > Any other ideas or options ?? > Thanks, Bill in Oregon
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > I’m moving off grid in June and looking for ideas so as to continue with > email thru an ISP. > Will be in an area where the wireless palm pilot systems doesn’t > cover. > Am considering using a cell phone interfaced to a desk-type computer > (120 VAC), and using a gas generator to run it. I’ve heard there are > problems using inverters to power computers…. plus I’ll need to run > the generator a half hour every two days anyway. (plus….a lap-top is > too expensive for me). > A few questions: > Is the voltage output from a 5 KW Generak type generator fairly > ‘clean’…..no harmful spikes to sensitive equipment ?? Is a filtering > network advised ?? > Can anyone recommend a brand and model of a (digital & analog) cell > phone that will connect to an external antenna, interface to computer > and be charged by a 12 VDC power source ?? > Any other ideas or options ?? > Thanks, Bill in Oregon
Have a look at some of the new ITX motherboard computers. Most of these use the VIA C3 processor series which is optimised for low power consumption. The EPIA M9000 has a 900MHz processor which is more than enough for the net, has everything except the modem integrated on the motherboard and runs without any need for cooling fans. The advantage over a laptop is that it uses standard PC disk drives, has a PCI expansion slot and the complete machine is way cheaper than a laptop. The box draws well under 100 watts and you can spend the money you save on an LCD display and run the whole thing easily via a small inverter from an ordinary auto battery.
Response:
I use a APC 350 watt inverter to power my dell laptop. With an lcd screen, it could also power a small desktop. Use a larger inverter if you have a big desktop with crt screen. I have had no problems running computers on inverters. Remember, a computer UPS is a dirty modified square wave inverter. I would never run a computer on generator power, only battery/inverter. — Steve Spence Subscribe to the Renewable Energy Newsletter & Discussion Boards. Read about Sustainable Technology: http://www.green-trust.org
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> I’m moving off grid in June and looking for ideas so as to continue > with email thru an ISP. > Will be in an area where the wireless palm pilot systems doesn’t > cover. > Am considering using a cell phone interfaced to a desk-type computer > (120 VAC), and using a gas generator to run it. I’ve heard there are > problems using inverters to power computers…. plus I’ll need to run > the generator a half hour every two days anyway. (plus….a lap-top > is too expensive for me). > A few questions: > Is the voltage output from a 5 KW Generak type generator fairly > ‘clean’…..no harmful spikes to sensitive equipment ?? Is a > filtering network advised ?? > Can anyone recommend a brand and model of a (digital & analog) cell > phone that will connect to an external antenna, interface to computer > and be charged by a 12 VDC power source ?? > Any other ideas or options ?? > Thanks, Bill in Oregon
Response:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> I’m moving off grid in June and looking for ideas so as to continue > with email thru an ISP. > Will be in an area where the wireless palm pilot systems doesn’t > cover. > Am considering using a cell phone interfaced to a desk-type computer > (120 VAC), and using a gas generator to run it. I’ve heard there are > problems using inverters to power computers…. plus I’ll need to run > the generator a half hour every two days anyway. (plus….a lap-top > is too expensive for me). > A few questions: > Is the voltage output from a 5 KW Generak type generator fairly > ‘clean’…..no harmful spikes to sensitive equipment ?? Is a > filtering network advised ?? > Can anyone recommend a brand and model of a (digital & analog) cell > phone that will connect to an external antenna, interface to computer > and be charged by a 12 VDC power source ??
Virtually all cell phones can be recharged by 12VDC power sources. Just a matter of getting a cigarette lighter adapter. getting an interface to a computer is a little harder though. Many old analog cell phones can be hooked to standard modems with a special cable you buy from from the cell phone manufacturer (or on eBay these days). A special protocol is used by the modem to communicate through the cell phone but its probably built into most modems these days, but check and make sure. Won’t work very fast (9600 is about tops). But it does work. Common digital phones can NOT be used this way. You need a phone setup for data. Many cell phone companies have this capability, others do not. If it has this capability, its just a matter of buying a cable. Sprint may have data service in the area you will be in. You may wish to contact them and ask about it. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> Any other ideas or options ?? > Thanks, Bill in Oregon
Response:
snipped > A PC should work fine off of a small cheap inverter. PC’s ride out crappy > power better than most other appliances. You might consider buying a couple > of 6v 220ah Golf Cart type batteries at Sam’s club (~$40) and recharge them > with an automotive type charger when you run your generator. A 400 watt > inverter can be found for about $30 and will do the job fine. That way, you > can use the computer in relative tranquility with the generator silent.
We have been off grid for about 1.5 years. We are on starband and have used 2 different generators to power/recharge batteries. We have no technology? I’ll stick with the cell phone.) I use a laptop because the desktop is a bit more of power hog than we need to support. Feel free to email direct if you want more information. Maureen
Response:
>I use a APC 350 watt inverter to power my dell laptop. With an lcd screen, >it could also power a small desktop. Use a larger inverter if you have a big >desktop with crt screen. I have had no problems running computers on >inverters. Remember, a computer UPS is a dirty modified square wave >inverter. I would never run a computer on generator power, only >battery/inverter.
During a 30 hour grid interruption last February, I ran my electronically controlled propane furnace; computer; TV & radio; as well as lights; fridge; freezer and the well pump - on the 5 kw Honda - no problems. I’m not saying it’s a guarantee of no problems for others – just my personal experience. Other posters here have claimed that computers are OK on generator power. John T.
Response:
>I use a APC 350 watt inverter to power my dell laptop. With an lcd screen, >it could also power a small desktop. Use a larger inverter if you have a big >desktop with crt screen. I have had no problems running computers on >inverters. Remember, a computer UPS is a dirty modified square wave >inverter. I would never run a computer on generator power, only >battery/inverter.
I am curious Steve. Why would the power supply of the PC care much. It generally can deal with wide variation in voltage and frequency. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> During a 30 hour grid interruption last February, I ran my > electronically controlled propane furnace; computer; TV & radio; > as well as lights; fridge; freezer and the well pump - on the 5 kw > Honda - no problems. > I’m not saying it’s a guarantee of no problems for others – just my > personal experience. Other posters here have claimed that computers > are OK on generator power. > John T.
Response:
a few generators use inverters, and provide cleaner output than alternator output only. most generators have frequency and voltage drift that is not healthy for electronic equipment. — Steve Spence Subscribe to the Renewable Energy Newsletter & Discussion Boards. Read about Sustainable Technology: http://www.green-trust.org
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->I use a APC 350 watt inverter to power my dell laptop. With an lcd screen, >it could also power a small desktop. Use a larger inverter if you have a big >desktop with crt screen. I have had no problems running computers on >inverters. Remember, a computer UPS is a dirty modified square wave >inverter. I would never run a computer on generator power, only >battery/inverter. > During a 30 hour grid interruption last February, I ran my > electronically controlled propane furnace; computer; TV & radio; > as well as lights; fridge; freezer and the well pump - on the 5 kw > Honda - no problems. > I’m not saying it’s a guarantee of no problems for others – just my > personal experience. Other posters here have claimed that computers > are OK on generator power. > John T.
Response:
<snip> >Have a look at some of the new ITX motherboard computers. Most of these >use the VIA C3 processor series which is optimised for low power >consumption. The EPIA M9000 has a 900MHz processor which is more than >enough for the net, has everything except the modem integrated on the >motherboard and runs without any need for cooling fans. The advantage over >a laptop is that it uses standard PC disk drives, has a PCI expansion slot >and the complete machine is way cheaper than a laptop. The box draws well >under 100 watts and you can spend the money you save on an LCD display and >run the whole thing easily via a small inverter from an ordinary auto >battery.
I have a 2.2 ghz with 1g of ram, 2 hard drives and a bunch of other stuff. I can run the whole thing along with a cable modem and router on a 300 watt inverter. I do have an 18" LCD monitor. This whole system normally runs about 225 watts when the cpu is running at 100%. If I were going to get a system where I would always be running on the inverter I would recommend doing something similar to what you suggested. Just make sure that you get enough memory. — Jim Rusling Partially Retired Mustang, OK http://www.rusling.org
Response:
>Am considering using a cell phone >interfaced to a desk-type computer >(120 VAC), and using a gas generator to >run it. I’ve heard there are >problems using inverters to power >computers..
No problem with Honda’s sine-wave "inverter" generators. Just used one to power a desktop, monitor, and two lights during the aftermath of an ice storm. <B>Dissident news – plus immigration, gun rights, nationwide weather <I><A HREF="http://www.alamanceind.com">ALAMANCE INDEPENDENT: official newspaper of the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy</A></b></i>
Response:
> >Am considering using a cell phone >interfaced to a desk-type computer >(120 VAC), and using a gas generator to >run it. I’ve heard there are >problems using inverters to power >computers.. > No problem with Honda’s sine-wave "inverter" generators. Just used one to > power a desktop, monitor, and two lights during the aftermath of an ice storm. > <B>Dissident news – plus immigration, gun rights, nationwide weather > <I><A HREF="http://www.alamanceind.com">ALAMANCE INDEPENDENT: > official newspaper of the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy</A></b></i>
THANKS TO ALL of you for the good and helpful info. Bill in Oregon
Response:
I agree that the laptop is a good idea. Easier to take to someone if you need software assistance. Also has a built-in backup power supply. Laptops are no longer as expensive as they used to be. Especially if you go with one in the 6 to 8 pound range, you can get a nice system for $800. Stephen
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> We have been off grid for about 1.5 years. We are on starband and have > used 2 different generators to power/recharge batteries. We have no > technology? I’ll stick with the cell phone.) I use a laptop because > the desktop is a bit more of power hog than we need to support. Feel > free to email direct if you want more information. > Maureen
Response:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > snipped > A PC should work fine off of a small cheap inverter. PC’s ride out crappy > power better than most other appliances. You might consider buying a couple > of 6v 220ah Golf Cart type batteries at Sam’s club (~$40) and recharge them > with an automotive type charger when you run your generator. A 400 watt > inverter can be found for about $30 and will do the job fine. That way, you > can use the computer in relative tranquility with the generator silent. > We have been off grid for about 1.5 years. We are on starband and have > used 2 different generators to power/recharge batteries. We have no > technology? I’ll stick with the cell phone.) I use a laptop because > the desktop is a bit more of power hog than we need to support. Feel > free to email direct if you want more information. > Maureen
Landlines may become obsolete. You can get better pricing on cell phones these days. What has you experience been with Starband? Do you have a separate sat modem?
Response:
> Landlines may become obsolete. You can get better pricing on cell phones > these > days. > What has you experience been with Starband? Do you have a separate sat > modem?
Yes we do. It has been very good. We have had more problems with the TV DISH system and they share a dish–go figure! It isn’t a good system for internet phone or real time gaming because of the lag but since no one here does that we like it fine. Really high winds and moisture can mess with reception but even with all the snow (I’m in Colorado) the last couple days, I’ve been able to connect. Maureen
